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    Critical Thinking

    Kitkat
    Kitkat

    Critical Thinking Empty Critical Thinking

    Post by Kitkat Tue 22 Apr 2014, 09:51

    Critical Thinking's Blog is here:

    http://www.critical-thinking.org.uk/blog/index.php


    From the Critical Thinking website:

    Critical thinking is a methodological approach to assessing claims. It is an analytical approach to inquiry which can be used positively: in business; by consumers; in the defence against being defrauded or scammed; as an intellectual exercise; and in increasing one's knowledge and awareness of reality in general.

    The idea is to look beyond claims, beliefs and opinions which are often accepted at face value, and look at whether there is good reason or evidence to support such claims.

    On this website we apply this approach to everyday claims we're all exposed to as consumers such as advertising claims, scams, alternative medicine, etc., so we can make more informed decisions about these issues despite being bombarded with misinformation from deceptive persuasion to downright lies.
    Umberto Cocopop
    Umberto Cocopop

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    Post by Umberto Cocopop Tue 22 Apr 2014, 16:30

    Wow! What a fabulous website. A work of genius.  :thumb: 
    Kitkat
    Kitkat

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    Post by Kitkat Fri 25 Apr 2014, 12:26

    Shame the Forum is no longer included though.  I just don't really see the point in having a Blog-type website where others are not able to join in, comment and interact - notwithstanding the fact it may have some interesting and informative articles etc, it is still just one person's thoughts and opinions.  However brilliant those opinions might be  cleverclogs , it doesn't wet the whistle for folk who like to explore stuff from all angles - or even the odd person  obgob  who might enjoy a good argument - er.... discussion.  pirat

     sidestep 
    Umberto Cocopop
    Umberto Cocopop

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    Post by Umberto Cocopop Sun 27 Apr 2014, 16:52

    The forum is still there as an archive but I can't be bothered with running it.

    I have thought about adding a commenting system for the articles (or perhaps just the blog entries) but again, I can't really be bothered with administering it.

    It's really nothing more than me adding content as and when I feel like it.

    I still have updates to articles such as the alternative medicine one and the placebo effect to do. I remember talking to you about these rewrites at the UKS conference back in 2009. I've had several articles prepared for years now but still haven't got round to writing them up. Obviously, my motivation is low!

    I'm very busy with work at the moment so the updates will have to wait for now.

    I have done a few so far this year though.

    - Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence

    - Alternative medicine works in animals and children

    And a few other small updates.

    The site is still very popular and gets good results in Google. I've always considered that a lot more important than developing a group of followers who already agree with you.
    Kitkat
    Kitkat

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    Post by Kitkat Mon 28 Apr 2014, 11:55

    Umberto Cocopop wrote:I still have updates to articles such as the alternative medicine one and the placebo effect to do. I remember talking to you about these rewrites at the UKS conference back in 2009.

    That was 5 years ago!!!!   UK Skeptics Paranormal Conference - Muncaster 2009


    Umberto Cocopop wrote:I've had several articles prepared for years now but still haven't got round to writing them up. Obviously, my motivation is low!

    Understatement of the year!  cyclops  giggle 


    Umberto Cocopop wrote:I have done a few so far this year though.

    - Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence

    - Alternative medicine works in animals and children
    I will have a bit of a read of those when get a chance.  Very Happy
    Umberto Cocopop
    Umberto Cocopop

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    Post by Umberto Cocopop Mon 28 Apr 2014, 15:53

    KitKat wrote:That was 5 years ago!!!!

    Unbelievable isn't it?

    I'd never known time pass so slowly during the lead up to it and then it was over in a flash - and here we are almost 5 years on.

    KitKat wrote:Understatement of the year!  cyclops  giggle 

    I think once you realize that none of this stuff is at all important in any way, there's no point in doing it unless it's just a hobby or of general interest.

    KitKat wrote:I will have a bit of a read of those when get a chance.  Very Happy

    One will be popular with skeptics - the other one won't. I wonder if you can guess which way round it is?  giggle 

    Kitkat
    Kitkat

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    Post by Kitkat Fri 09 May 2014, 14:05

    Kitkat wrote:
    Umberto Cocopop wrote:I have done a few so far this year though.

    - Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence

    - Alternative medicine works in animals and children

    I will have a bit of a read of those when get a chance.  Very Happy

    Referring to the first link: Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence :

    "Although there are instances where its usage as a precautionary approach to accepting unlikely claims may seem appropriate, caution should always be exercised when ECREE is used or encountered as it is not a universal principle and so can be misapplied or even abused: to dismiss evidence, avoid debate, avoid assessing pertinent claims, etc."

    Critical Thinking Yes  I have seen the term abused over and over again, incorporating all three of the above examples, by certain members/followers involved in a small section of the 'skeptical community'.  annoyed 

    "This problem of equivocation may have arisen simply because the phrase was designed to be catchy and memorable"

    I think that's it, in a nutshell.  It IS catchy and it IS memorable - but frequently used without the quoter's comprehensive understanding of what the original message actually relates to.
    Umberto Cocopop
    Umberto Cocopop

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    Post by Umberto Cocopop Sat 10 May 2014, 14:40

    I didn't include it in the article, to keep it concise, but the JREF £1,000,000 challenge actually relies on the fact that the sort of paranormal claims they test do not require "extraordinary" evidence. The tests they do have to be completed within 1 day!

    They may set the odds of passing at a high level but as the tests are designed to work on a pass or fail protocol, they end up being relatively simple.

    Those who parrot ECREE are often the typical non-thinking 'skeptics' who follow Randi and his ilk blindly. I find the irony amusing.

    Having said that, I've seen ECREE used in academic papers too....
    Kitkat
    Kitkat

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    Post by Kitkat Sat 10 May 2014, 19:34

    Look what I found!  pirat ... purely by accident, or coincidence ... or something ....   surprised 

    Browsing through the Internet Archive for something totally unrelated (or so I thought) ....  confused. 

    I came first to this link:  http://www.critical-thinking.org.uk/forum/archive/index.php/t-2681.html

    bindeweede
    26th June 2008, 11:52 PM

    Spiritlove - is this http://spiritlove.freeforums.org/portal.php ?

    Sorry not familiar?

    Yes, Bunny.

    You might be interested on clicking on the "Forum" link. There have been "dialogues" between members of UKS and that forum. One of the shared areas of interest has been the "Gary Mannion" thread - if you have a few weeks to spare.

    spiritlove is what many people might describe as a "believers'" forum.


    and from there it took me to

    http://www.critical-thinking.org.uk/forum/forum.php


    (I couldn't find that from the actual site! )   drunken
    Kitkat
    Kitkat

    Critical Thinking Empty Missing Madeline McCann back in the news

    Post by Kitkat Mon 02 Jun 2014, 17:56

    With the Madeline McCann case being currently back in the news (it's never really been out of the news, but pushed to top headlines again as the police concentrate on a new search of the scrubland http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27659905  surrounding the area of Praia da Luz in Portugal) - I remembered there had been quite a bit written up on the old UK-Skeptics forum (amongst other places) surrounding Madeline McCann, and had a search to refresh my memory.  
    Brought me to this interesting article in the Critical Thinking Blog , which I had not read before:  McCanns, blame, and attribution theory .

    The 'Blame Game' has always been a particular bug-bear of mine - where (talked about in the article), some people will always find someone or something else to blame for the misfortunes that happen to them.  I see this trait a lot, in many different situations, even among some of my own circle of friends & family.  Indeed, some of us have had long, [unresolved] discussions on this very subject.  Many do not even realise that they do it - all the time, and that in some cases, in doing so they are actually bringing upon themselves further worry/upset/stress by creating new unnecessary situations for themselves.

    It's not true to say that this is a natural reaction for everyone though, as seems to be the opinion in this example, for instance:

    To illustrate the internal/external causation explanation, think about this:

       You come home from shopping and you’re tired;
       You plonk your handbag on the kitchen table and go to bed for a rest;
       You get up later only to find that someone has forced the kitchen window and stolen your bag.

    If this happened to you you’d have no hesitation in blaming the burglar: i.e. attributing the cause to an external event.
    No, I wouldn't 'blame' the burglar in this instance - I would most definitely admonish myself for having left my bag out in full view of the kitchen window - and would put it down to experience, seeing it as a lesson learned, making me more aware, and  I would make sure not to do it again!
    I would also be quite shaken, and worried that the burglar might return (as very often is the case) but the fact that having learned a lesson through that incident, I would in that event have become, let's say a little bit wiser - and so gained something positive from the experience.

    Is it perhaps something to do with being a person with an overall positive outlook, as opposed to a negative one?
    (I have found, certainly amongst the 'blamers' that I personally know - that this negative trait is dominant in all).
    Umberto Cocopop
    Umberto Cocopop

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    Post by Umberto Cocopop Wed 04 Jun 2014, 02:04

    Kitkat wrote:It's not true to say that this is a natural reaction for everyone though

    It doesn't say that though (!)

    Kitkat wrote:No, I wouldn't 'blame' the burglar in this instance

    Most people would though.

    The burglar would still be 100% to blame even if you created a tempting situation.

    Kitkat wrote:Is it perhaps something to do with being a person with an overall positive outlook, as opposed to a negative one?

    I don't think optimism is a factor. Your strong propensity for superstitious thinking (tempting fate, etc.) is probably a better explanation.

    From the article:

    the parents’ decision to leave their children unattended facilitated the crime by making it easier to commit

    Good bit of English there.  :thumb: 

    I hope Searcher's not reading!  sidestep 
    Umberto Cocopop
    Umberto Cocopop

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    Post by Umberto Cocopop Wed 04 Jun 2014, 02:24

    Kitkat wrote:http://www.critical-thinking.org.uk/forum/forum.php

    (I couldn't find that from the actual site! )   drunken

    The forum's not active. I'll be deleting it soon as it's a waste of bandwidth.

    I used to make quite a lot of money from the adverts, but these days, people have ad blockers running so the revenue has fallen to the point where hosting it (the forum gets a lot of hits and uses up around 10Gb of bandwidth a month) will end up costing me money.

    Kitkat
    Kitkat

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    Post by Kitkat Thu 05 Jun 2014, 09:12

    Umberto Cocopop wrote:The forum's not active. I'll be deleting it soon as it's a waste of bandwidth.

     thumbdown  What is bandwidth - compared to the amount of time and effort that went into creating the forum - not to mention the valuable contributions of all those who took part in its postings.  What a waste it would be for all that to be so drastically destroyed.  It doesn't make sense to sweep the whole thing out of existence!  .... all for the sake of a bit o' bandwidth.   angry 

    Umberto Cocopop wrote:I used to make quite a lot of money from the adverts, but these days, people have ad blockers running so the revenue has fallen to the point where hosting it (the forum gets a lot of hits and uses up around 10Gb of bandwidth a month) will end up costing me money.

    So!  It's money that's the key issue here, is it?  You know what ... my cats cost me quite a bit of money to keep.  Now that they're gone I have a bit more money in my pocket to play around with, but I would gladly sacrifice that bit of extra cash to have them back here with me.  No amount of money can ever compensate for that loss.   judge
    Umberto Cocopop
    Umberto Cocopop

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    Post by Umberto Cocopop Thu 05 Jun 2014, 11:02

    The forum is defunct and pointless. I only kept things running as I was making income from it but as I sell hosting accounts as a part of my online business portfolio, the 10GB bandwidth is a useful, money-making asset that's being wasted on something that's about as useful as a sponge pisspot!

    I came to see 'skepticism' as a joke, so I don't look back on it nostalgically. Although I learned a lot over the last 10 years or so, I wish I had discovered that it was Critical Thinking that I was really interested in and not the bastardized version known as 'skepticism'.

    I don't look back at UKS fondly. It wasted a lot of my time by going off in the wrong direction...
    Kitkat
    Kitkat

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    Post by Kitkat Thu 05 Jun 2014, 13:37

    Umberto Cocopop wrote:The forum is defunct and pointless. I only kept things running as I was making income from it but as I sell hosting accounts as a part of my online business portfolio, the 10GB bandwidth is a useful, money-making asset that's being wasted on something that's about as useful as a sponge pisspot!

    I came to see 'skepticism' as a joke, so I don't look back on it nostalgically.

    It's part of history, Umbo!  Part of your history; in that it played an important role in bringing you to what you are today.

    Surely, that can't be viewed as a "waste".


    Umberto Cocopop wrote:Although I learned a lot over the last 10 years or so, I wish I had discovered that it was Critical Thinking that I was really interested in and not the bastardized version known as 'skepticism'.

    I don't look back at UKS fondly. It wasted a lot of my time by going off in the wrong direction...

     violin2 

    Would you not agree that the Forum played an important role in helping you to arrive at that discovery?  The very fact that you came to think differently because of the direction it was veering into - is surely not something to be dismissed.  The forum in its own way helped you (and possibly others) to come to that important realisation.

    That aside, it still contains many interesting points of reference (links, etc) - which could be of benefit to newcomers on the 'scene'.
    Umberto Cocopop
    Umberto Cocopop

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    Post by Umberto Cocopop Fri 06 Jun 2014, 15:14

    If life is a journey consisting of many steps, then my involvement with 'skepticism' was the day I stepped on a dog turd. schaterlach 

    Don't get me wrong, the forum at times was very good and there were some excellent posters on there, many of whom I liked and respected, but it's 'skepticism' as a whole I look back on as something I wish I'd never bothered with. The forum is a part of that and so I place no value on it.


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